Whining sound in my tranny ***MORE FEEDBACK***

genie47 · Post by **genie47** » Tue Dec 20, 2005 1:52 am

I do know some cars need ATF in their manual gearboxes but I do not have any data for Opel for ATF in manual gearboxes.

MMamdouh · Post by **MMamdouh** » Tue Dec 20, 2005 6:40 am

new question concerning this issue... what componets of the tranny spins when the car in neutral?

if the car is in neutral and the engine running i can hear the whining... not as loud as when it is in gear but it is their... when the clutch is applied the sound goes away so i recon the part that is doing the whining is a spinning part that is directly linked to the clutch.

what part is that? can it be replaced without having to buy a whole new tranny? sorry i don't know that much about tranny internal parts so any feedback is appreciated.

MMamdouh

GsiTurbo · Post by **GsiTurbo** » Tue Dec 20, 2005 6:59 pm

OK, when I open the F16 the very first time, it filled with red fluid...very much looking like the ATF transmission (Dexron 3)... I filled it with synthethic gear oil.

Now, about the noise. Check this carefully. Let the motor warm up, and park the car with the motor running. Listen for the noise and raise the RPM a tad. See if you can hear change in tone of noise proportional to the engine speed.

If the noise goes away when you press the clutch, and goes back when you release it, I'd say this may be your clutch release bearing. Not very expensive, but requires to drop the gearbox.

Tom

GsiTurbo · Post by **GsiTurbo** » Tue Dec 20, 2005 7:10 pm

You can remove the lower gearbox shield. This will expose the clutch/pressure plate/release bearing with fork assy. Examine that area for dirt/oil contamination. You can attempt to wash it with a brake cleaner....then re-lubricate it with special grease used for release bearing (its sulphyde-someting grease, cant remember the exact name right now).

Tom

MMamdouh · Post by **MMamdouh** » Tue Dec 20, 2005 7:30 pm

i managed to get some accurate diagnosis of my problem and i will share it with you all so that tyuo can help me more here:

1- today i have noticed that the whining sound is still audiable when the engine is idling and the the clutch not applied... when the clutch is applied the sound goes away.

2- i also noticed that the whining is not in 2nd gear... it is just most evedent in 2nd gear procicly at 20 Km/h (12.5MPH)... anything over or under that the sound is not as loud but it does exist and on 3rd or higher gears the sound is faded into the engine sound and wind noise and all.

3- also the engine is more audiable now through the whole cocpet... i can hear the engine firing during startup more clearly than before.

now adding all that up we will get the following conclusins:

i recon i have a bad bearing or so at the main shaft that is connected to the clutch plate... thats why the whining is noticed when the clutch is not applied (shaft spinning) and it goes away when it is pressed (shaft stops).

also this explains why the sound is present at almost all gears... it is hard to ruin all tranny gears at the same time but if the shaft that is always connected to the engine is making this whining then you will hear it in all gears.

i guess it is more audiable at second gear due to sound reasonance or something cause the sound rises up till 20Km/h then starts to get lower again at 2nd then almost the same at all other gears... or maybe i have a 2nd gear problem as well.

the reason i noticed that after the engine mounts job is that the engine/tranny is conducting much more sound through the new mounts as the old ones hardly conducted any simply because they are busted.

also i am sure it is not a prop shaft or CV joint problem as their is sound even when the car at a halt... i made sure that the tranny is the sound source using a long screw driver as a listener.

now does this sound logical and close enough to be true??

as for what to do to solve this; i need first to know if their are any replacable bearings inside the tranny or maybe i can get a whole shaft to replace the faulty one.

i am considring a swap option that will cost me some 1000 LE (178.50USD) where i get to trade in my tranny with a used one... consider it as getting a tranny from a junk yard option.

now what do you guys think and what do you recommend??

MMamdouh

MMamdouh · Post by **MMamdouh** » Tue Dec 20, 2005 7:34 pm

360 Dynamics wrote: If the noise goes away when you press the clutch, and goes back when you release it, I'd say this may be your clutch release bearing. Not very expensive, but requires to drop the gearbox.

Tom

i think it goes the other way round Tom... the bearing is at a load when the clutch is applied and at no load when the clutch is released... this is why people that drive with ther left foot leaning on the clutch fry clutch bearings because they are leting the bearing to spin all the time.

please correct me if i am wrong.

MMamdouh

MMamdouh · Post by **MMamdouh** » Tue Dec 20, 2005 7:40 pm

360 Dynamics wrote:Now, about the noise. Check this carefully. Let the motor warm up, and park the car with the motor running. Listen for the noise and raise the RPM a tad. See if you can hear change in tone of noise proportional to the engine speed.
Tom

well... the engine noise is louder than the tranny noise when revved up...i am sure though that the noise is perfictly cosistent with the engine RPM.

MMamdouh

MMamdouh · Post by **MMamdouh** » Sun Feb 26, 2006 9:44 am

according to the diagnosis in the service manual i got to change almost every bearing in the tranny... i guess it is much easyer and cheaper to get a used tranny... right?

MMamdouh

bluecube · Post by **bluecube** » Sun Feb 26, 2006 9:51 am

I'd have a good look at the clutch release bearing. Mine was stuffed (kinda seperated into 2 parts) and I didnt realise this until the whole tranny was off the car. It can be a bit hard to see from the inspection cover under the tranny. I am confident that it would be your release bearing as it spins according to engine rpm and wont spin when the clutch is pressed in. As 360 said, the bearing is inexpensive but I would reccommend doing a whole clutch kit while you have the tranny off.

MMamdouh · Post by **MMamdouh** » Sun Feb 26, 2006 10:59 am

the clutch bearing only spins when the clutch is applied... the whining sound stops when i press the clutch pedal so it can't be the clutch bearing.

MMamdouh

bluecube · Post by **bluecube** » Sun Feb 26, 2006 10:57 pm

Sorry, my bad. You do have the correct amount and correct type of fluid in the tranny don't you?

bluecube · Post by **bluecube** » Sun Feb 26, 2006 10:59 pm

Could also be the bearings for the diff. However this wouldnt explain the noise at idle.

MMamdouh · Post by **MMamdouh** » Mon Feb 27, 2006 12:15 am

i got the correct amount of fluid indeed... the OEM fluid was at the correct level, it was replaced by ATF which was at the correct level then flushed and replaced with tranny fluid and currently at the correct level as well.

you are right its a bearing and it is related to the main shaft that is connected to the clutch plate as when the car at idle you can hear some noise but once the clutch is applied the sound goes away... also second gear wines and it is most loud at 20Km/h

MMamdouh

Audacity Racing · Post by **Audacity Racing** » Mon Feb 27, 2006 12:19 am

it's not the synchros is it? i had a synchro go bad in my golf a few years ago and what happened was it was not coming off the gears, so all the synchros were spinning at engine speed instead of wheel speed. made for some hellacious noises

woo · Post by **woo** » Mon Feb 27, 2006 12:26 am

my girlfriends sister had a very whiny 5 speed in he festiva, after a while it got worse and the stick was vibrating more and more and was eventually slipping out of gear. What had happened, was the imput shaft was very worn and was moving arount inside the bearings, so she had to get the box rebuilt and they put in a new imput shaft and all new bearings.

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Whining sound in my tranny MORE FEEDBACK