Turbo Optra - Now on tuned Haltech @ 225whp

[Pir0]

Jesus! They really do look alike! That's actually quite scary o_o Especially because priuses are a genuinly ugly car. [yours isnt, but with the snow.. Different story >_>]

[exist3nce]

While I have them side by side, I decided to make some brief visual comparisons. I have not started the swap yet, the D20 is my broken one from before.

F28 vs D20

D20 = 83lbs = 37.6kg
F28 = 112lbs = 50.8kg

-First thing I notice is the weight of course, F28 is about 30 lbs heavier!
-Next major thing was the size of the input shafts, F28 is significantly larger and beefier. D20 shaft looks like a pencil beside it lol. (the picture doesn't do it justice)
-F28 appears to have two plugs on it for internal sensors, one has to be the reverse signal, and I've read the other is a 1st gear signal which was used by the 4x4 system.
-D20 also looks as if it could run the cable clutch without issue which makes sense given how close it is to F20
-both appear to have identical speedo drive (I test fitted the speedo signal sender from D20 on the F28, and it fits right on no problem)
-F28 has drain and fill holes, while D20 only has fill.
-F28 casing says GETRAG on it D20 says Daewoo

On to the pictures...

[mr_g]

But inside is the real difference. Totally different way of gears shifting...

[kinkyllama]

D20 = 83lbs = 37.6kg
F28 = 112lbs = 50.8kg

-First thing I notice is the weight of course, F28 is about 30 lbs heavier!

Ouch...not too bad though since you can push 80ft.lbs more

I wonder what the D16 weights.

[Pir0]

D20 = 83lbs = 37.6kg
F28 = 112lbs = 50.8kg

-First thing I notice is the weight of course, F28 is about 30 lbs heavier!

Ouch...not too bad though since you can push 80ft.lbs more

I wonder what the D16 weights.

I'd say it wouldnt be much lighter than the d20, they arent as strong, so the internals wouldnt be as heavy i imagine. But not by much.

If they're anything like the f16 and f20, they have 100% identically similar housing, except the plate and the F20/F16 name on it.

[Nubaroo]

I was expecting the GETRAG box to be bigger??? Some guys told me that the GETRAG box is bigger and one needs to modify bits and pieces to get the space needed for the bigger box???

Keep us posted on mods needed to fit the getrag please - I am also thinking about one.

[Pir0]

That is the Getrag box, the f28 is the bigger of the 2

[gse_turbo]

It's a good thing that existence posted these last pics, they confirm what I was afraid of...

The F28 uses a 1" 14 spline and (if I remember) ALL others use a 3/4" or 13/16" (basically the same) 24 spline.

I just wanted to clear that up because we are getting clutch kit made and I was going to send exist3nce a 24 spline kit until I saw his comparison pics.

now I said it's "what I was afraid of" but it's not really anything special, the 1" 14 spline is the most common GM FWD imput shaft so having kits made for it is nothing to worry about.

[exist3nce]

It's a good thing that existence posted these last pics, they confirm what I was afraid of...

The F28 uses a 1" 14 spline and (if I remember) ALL others use a 3/4" or 13/16" (basically the same) 24 spline.

I just wanted to clear that up because we are getting clutch kit made and I was going to send exist3nce a 24 spline kit until I saw his comparison pics.

now I said it's "what I was afraid of" but it's not really anything special, the 1" 14 spline is the most common GM FWD imput shaft so having kits made for it is nothing to worry about.

Yep thanks for noticing that "slight" difference hehe and good thing I posted those pics in time!

[Efratech]

my transmision F16 was out today so took a few pics to compare

http://www.daewootech.com/forum/viewtop ... 3938#93938

[exist3nce]

Car has been feeling a bit strange lately..... Best way to describe it is inconsistent low end weakness. Mostly I can only feel it out of boost and it just feels like the car doesn't want to move as "urgently" as it normally does. Whats strange is that sometimes it feels fine, and others it feels really weak.

So I went to the local auto store and bought a compression tester kit and tested each cylinder.

Starting from the crank pulley side this is what I got:

1: 180 psi
2: 180
3: 170
4: 120

Note that motor was warm for this test....... not sure if thats good or bad, but I figure thats how its driven 99% of the time anyways (with a hot motor).

120 psi on cyl 4 isn't too good I know.... I'm going to talk to my shop tomorrow about it, see what they say.

Any ideas from you guys? I'm guessing the rings probably aren't sealing that well anymore. Maybe its a good time to swap to my spare motor and rebuild this one haha.

[exist3nce]

Some pictures of the clutch I received from gse_turbo (Garrett). Appears to be a good quality unit!






Hope to get the transmission in before the end of the month, but both mine and my shop's schedule have gotten pretty busy.

[gse_turbo]

two things could be happening here that would hive you readings like this.

#1 where all the plugs out when you started testing, where they all in and did you take them out as you went and not put the plug back in after each test? keep in mind that all the cylinders should be subject to the same forces. so either all the plugs have to be out or they all have to be in, that means after you pull one plug to test you put it back before moving on. I'm in favor of all the plugs being out because you isolate the cylinder better.

#2 if the test took a bit of time and/or it's cold where you are doing the test than the motor will be at different temps from when you start to when you finish. what I would say is do the test again before the car is run for the day. the reason that heat is a factor especially after running boost is that the rings will expand and shrink. if you start when the motor is hot and finish when the motor is cool that the rings will seal differently and you could get a different reading.

...one other tip I have is the you test each cylinder twice, meaning you hook up the gauge, crank the motor, clear the gauge but don't remove it and then crank again. I'm not sure if it will make a difference but it's good technique.

hope everything is sorted soon.

Garrett

[exist3nce]

two things could be happening here that would hive you readings like this.

#1 where all the plugs out when you started testing, where they all in and did you take them out as you went and not put the plug back in after each test? keep in mind that all the cylinders should be subject to the same forces. so either all the plugs have to be out or they all have to be in, that means after you pull one plug to test you put it back before moving on. I'm in favor of all the plugs being out because you isolate the cylinder better.

#2 if the test took a bit of time and/or it's cold where you are doing the test than the motor will be at different temps from when you start to when you finish. what I would say is do the test again before the car is run for the day. the reason that heat is a factor especially after running boost is that the rings will expand and shrink. if you start when the motor is hot and finish when the motor is cool that the rings will seal differently and you could get a different reading.

...one other tip I have is the you test each cylinder twice, meaning you hook up the gauge, crank the motor, clear the gauge but don't remove it and then crank again. I'm not sure if it will make a difference but it's good technique.

hope everything is sorted soon.

Garrett

I've seen compression tests done before so I pretty much followed from what I remember. I removed ALL plugs and only put the tester in the cylinder I was testing. I ran 3 tests on each cyl and took the avg. Engine was hot when we started and the whole thing was done within 20mins. I don't think the engine could have cooled down that much because it was a nice sunny day outside. I will be doing the test again. After talking to my shop on the phone, they recommend putting some oil in the low cylinder and see if that raises the compression at all so we'll have an idea whether its rings/piston or valves.

In all likeliness I will just switch to my spare motor and then take this one apart and see whats up. I did a compression test about 4 months ago and that cylinder was 160 psi, so its definitely gotten worse.

Whats funny is that the car is still quick under boost and I've still been ripping it around LOL

[gse_turbo]

well atleast you have a back up motor. sorry for the hang up, atleast now you can install the spare motor and F28 tranny together, that should make things go a bit faster.

Garrett