Injector probs!

[Turtle_Wax]

Hi guys, I posted a while back about having the injectors serviced and ultrasonic cleaned on my Lanos sohc. Well I have to say that it was a big mistake and the car has never driven properly since. After having them cleaned the engine now idles rough and spluttery and every couple of seconds you can hear and feel dips in the engine (similar to a miss fire from a faulty spark or lead).

I did notice a slight improvement in acceleration but at low end revs the car felt jerky and when you just touch the throttle you can feel it hesitating and juddering. I took it to my mechanic friend and he had a box of daewoo spares including a fuel rail and injectors. He didn't know what model the injectors came from but they looked the same as mine but the fuel rail was a different shape and had the fuel pressure regulator mounted at the end of the rail. The injectors looked the same so I fitted them to my rail and the car is now driving much smoother and idles better as it did before having the injectors cleaned. I can only think that the garage who serviced the original injectors made a complete mess of it or the stock woo injectors are sensitive and not designed to be serviced!

Thought I'd just let you know my experience to warn others thinking about having their stock woo injectors cleaned that there's a chance it won't run right after. I read that Bosch injectors fitted to the older BMW 1.6 perform better in the Lanos than the stock ones so I'll keep an eye out for some.

[mezomaster]

I tried to warn u before about my story cuz it was the same and i also cleaned them by the same way and finally i ended up buying the BMW injectors and they are working so great, congratulations for the new injectors anyway

[Spider]

I am thinking that over time with all the gas that goes thru an injector ?
Even if it is clean, it must be "worn" and allowing more gas to go thru than originally.
Everything has a life, right ?

[Turtle_Wax]

Well I've learned my lesson and won't be doing that again. I suppose other types of injectors may respond well to cleaning but not the woo.
Do you know what the Bosch injector number is that also works in the lanos? Is it in the below list.
http://www.injectorcleaning.co.uk/flow.htm

They also sell referbished injectors, anyone know if any of these will fit my woo?
http://www.injectorcleaning.co.uk/sale.htm

Thanks.

[MMamdouh]

I am thinking that over time with all the gas that goes thru an injector ?
Even if it is clean, it must be "worn" and allowing more gas to go thru than originally.
Everything has a life, right ?

yes indeed but a guy in an injector cleaning shop told me that the GM injector's design makes them more volunrable to problems than the BOSCH ones... i didn't see or compare both designs but the fact that a GM injector only lasted 42k kms and 3 years on my car whereas a BOSCH injector is still in top form after approxmatly 18 years and God knows how many kms of work supports what the guy says.

MMamdouh

[MMamdouh]

Well I've learned my lesson and won't be doing that again. I suppose other types of injectors may respond well to cleaning but not the woo.
Do you know what the Bosch injector number is that also works in the lanos? Is it in the below list.
http://www.injectorcleaning.co.uk/flow.htm

They also sell referbished injectors, anyone know if any of these will fit my woo?
http://www.injectorcleaning.co.uk/sale.htm

Thanks.

i have no idea about the P/N... just they are BOSCH injectors form a 1600CC M40 BMW engine.

MMamdouh

[Turtle_Wax]

Well I've learned my lesson and won't be doing that again. I suppose other types of injectors may respond well to cleaning but not the woo.
Do you know what the Bosch injector number is that also works in the lanos? Is it in the below list.
http://www.injectorcleaning.co.uk/flow.htm

They also sell referbished injectors, anyone know if any of these will fit my woo?
http://www.injectorcleaning.co.uk/sale.htm

Thanks.

i have no idea about the P/N... just they are BOSCH injectors form a 1600CC M40 BMW engine.

MMamdouh

Ok thanks, I'll keep a look out. Do you know if they have to come from a 1.6cc or do the bigger engines use different injectors? What colour are your injectors as I think Bosch use a colour code to identify them. Thanks

[MMamdouh]

Ok thanks, I'll keep a look out. Do you know if they have to come from a 1.6cc or do the bigger engines use different injectors? What colour are your injectors as I think Bosch use a colour code to identify them. Thanks

the bigger engines do use bigger injectors but the thing with BMW engines is that starting from 2000CC up till 3500CC those engines are 6 cylinder engines so the comparison is kinda tricky.

for a 1.6 daewoo engine you can certainly use the ones from the 1.6 BMW, i personally used those on the 1.5 SOHC and the 1.6 DOHC and they were great.

for a replacment injectors for the 2.0 DOHC i think the 3500CC injectors will be good match as the 3.5 engine is 6 cyl. (1.5 times more cylinders) and it uses the same injector as the 3000 engine so the singular injector is good for (3000/6)) 500cc cyl. and that is the capacity of a singular cylinder on a 4 cyl. 2.0 engine... we currently have those on the 2.0 Nubira and they are doing great.

as far as i remeber their are no smaller injectors than the ones i am using so it is the best choice for the 1.5 and 1.6... those injectors are blue top injectors:


the ones for the 2.0 engine are yellow top... and the pic i found for them is very convinent as it shows a comparison with the GM injector:


MMamdouh

[Turtle_Wax]

That's great, many thanks for your help and the pic.
Do you think this is the same Bosch injector as yours from this Austrailia online store? (the first injector on the product page)
http://www.injectorsonline.com/indivprod.php?c=1

cc 150 / lbs/hr 15 / hp 30 / Impedence High / Price 18uk pounds

I paid 20uk pounds each to have my injectors cleaned! If these are the same ones as yours it would have worked out cheaper for me to buy them brand new from this site instead of wasting money getting them cleaned and end up having them ruined.

[MMamdouh]

as far as i can see... yes

it is the same shape as the ones i got, same color code, the closest flow rate to a 1.5 SOHC lanos injectors (AFAIK 135cc), high impedance and they are the smallest injectors in the list flow wise

the funny thing is i used this page you posted to guide friends that needed those injectors in here

MMamdouh

[Turtle_Wax]

Cheers mate, I might treat myself to a set of those injectors but I did notice these on Ebay and wondered what you thought?

4 X GENUINE ORIGINAL BMW MINI COOPER S FUEL INJECTORS.
THESE WERE REMOVED FROM A BRAND NEW 2004 MODEL YEAR CAR AT PRE DELIVERY INSPECTION TO INSTALL
A JOHN COOPER WORKS UPGRADE KIT AND HAVE BEEN STORED IN A CLEAN DRY ENVIRONMENT SINCE.
THESE INJECTORS ARE IN `AS NEW ' CONDITION.



From what I've read these are Stock replacement part Siemens Deka p/n1521390 - 2002-2005 Mini S (Supercharged)
330cc 12ohms.
If they are the same size do you think it would be worth giving them a try if I could get them cheap? I see they are higher cc but I'm not sure if that's good or bad?

[MMamdouh]

330/135= 2.4

those injectors are 2.4 times bigger than your stock injectors so most probably you are going to get lots of idling problems as well as fuel economy issues with those.

i don't know how big the mini cooper S engine is but it says it is supercharged... this means the injectors are of a high flow rate and won't fit a N/A car with the same displacment as the mini... i recon those can be good for a N/A 3.6 4 cyl. engine if their is one or a turboed 1.6/2.0 or so

MMamdouh

[Turtle_Wax]

Thanks, I will play safe and get the blue ones. I've also discovered something else today.
Although the car has been running better since I swapped the GM injectors from my mechanic friend, but it still wasn't running as good as it did before I had the original injectors cleaned. There was still a lack of power and it just didn't seem to drive as good as it should and still idled a bit lumpy. Well having tried various things that made no difference I decided to unplug my O2 sensor and see what it did.

Oh boy what a massive difference it has made!!! I started the engine having pulled the O2 plug and I could tell straight away the engine sounded better and it idled beautiful and perfect. Took it for a spin and although I'm now getting a CEL because the O2 is disconnected, it drives much better smoother and loads more torque.

If it now drives better without the O2 connected then could the serviced injectors have also damaged the O2? It drove perfect before I had the original injectors cleaned. It was only as a treat to my car that I had them serviced because I thought it would do it good after 116k miles! Not only has it ruined the injectors but looks like it's also done in the O2 as well! I should have gone with the IF IT'S NOT BROKE DON'T FIX IT!

[MMamdouh]

maybe the O2 sensor just died.

maybe the dirty injectors contributed to fouling the sensor and it was one step away from dieing

MMamdouh

[Turtle_Wax]

Yes I think you may be right. Seeing clean injectors for the first time probably tipped it over the edge It's running much better leaving it disconnected but I'll have to get it fixed soon as I'm worried if it's now running rich without a O2 it may also damage the cat. Do you know if the O2 for the Lanos is the zirconium or titania?