Daewoo Lanos 1.4 2001 (Failing to start)

Wappy · Post by **Wappy** » Mon Aug 27, 2007 11:11 pm

Hi all im fairly new to the woo this is my first and hopefully not my last.

Ill try and get as much in as possible first and then we will go from there.

Following this post i'll list as much as i can

http://www.daewootech.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=5863

Details on car

Its a 1349cc 4 door saloon i've only done 90miles in it BUT there is 66,000 on the clock, car is regularly serviced (i know the previous owner) NO MODS AT ALL DONE TO THE CAR!!!

Problem

I bought the car aware that the ECU 10a fuse keeps blowing as i was told its about 4 times a year it goes just replace it and its fine. so took the car on and off i go!!! BUT the fuse blew with in 24 hours and so i replaced it and again the next time i'm out it goes again ?? at this point i was curios i knew it was something i was doing as it rarely happened before, any way pulled up home and then it went BUT!!! this time i could smell burning when it went but i couldn't find out where so i replaced the fuse again and turned on the car and bang fuse went and the burning was more prominent!!! and it enabled me to find the problem...... a wire was shorting on the chassis under the accelerators pedal just next to the ECU. NOW i've repaired all the damage wires (about 5 were bare and 1 had broken) reconnected everything and this is what now happens...

Car left for 20 to 30 mins with no power the car fires then imedietly dies re try and nothing just keeps turning over leave with no power for 20/30 mins and again it will start up then die but try again and nothing? just keeps turning over?

I thought maybe the ECU but surly if it was the ECU it wouldn't fire up at all regardless if it was left for 30mins or what ever.

ANY help would be greatly appreciated,

Thanks

The-Wappy-One

Turtle_Wax · Post by **Turtle_Wax** » Tue Aug 28, 2007 11:22 am

Could be an immobiliser / wiring problem. While the key code is being read by the immobiliser control unit the engine can start and run with any key that turns the barrel. If invalid or no code is detected it then disables the fuel pump & injector system. So with an immobiliser fault the car will start but dies a second later. Does the red LED near the clock stop flashing when you turn on ignition?

Wappy · Post by **Wappy** » Tue Aug 28, 2007 11:53 am

Thanks for the advice Turtle_Wax

Just been out and tried it and as soon as the ignition turns on the light stops flashing..

also just noticed when i turn the key off i can hear a pump (guesing its that) then what sounds like water going into a tank?

Btw when i repaired the wiring i used these

could that have any baring? i just cut out the bad sections and then crimped them.

EDIT : just curious could i buy a OBD tester off ebay like this one Click here and test the ECU myself as i've been quopted over £50 for a garage to do it (includes picking up the car) or send the ECU off to have it tested at £30 + Postage? it would help for future problems and ITS cheaper

jidasas · Post by **jidasas** » Tue Aug 28, 2007 10:11 pm

In my experience those connections are kind of bad...unless you can solder them. I know when I installed my tach I use one at first and it only lasted a week before coming unhooked. I also used them on my stereo in my old car and had the same thing happen so I would recommend using solder and the shrink tubing to cover the spots.

Jimmy

daewoomofo · Post by **daewoomofo** » Tue Aug 28, 2007 10:54 pm

ive used TONS of those connectors, they work great, as long as you use the correct crimpers, not pliers or channel locks, i actually keep some of those and a pair of crimpers in my car in case i need to fix a loose wire or sonething else, but thats the only advice ia can give you, as im not the greatest at figuring wireing problems out, sorry.

Post by **PrecisionBoost** » Wed Aug 29, 2007 12:22 am

I will second the opinon on the regular butt splice connectors.... when used correctly you can break the wire before breaking the crimp connection.... I've installed literally 10's of thousands of these over my life time.... many in car audio installs for myself and others.... many of them at my company where we wire up our mobile darkrooms (like a camper) to 3/4 ton and 1 ton trucks on a very regular basis.

Basicly.... the primary damage would be from the cause of the short back to the fuse panel.... but it's also possible that by grounding the ECU you've damaged it.

Inside the ECU there will be a power supply circuit designed to filter out all noise ( alternator, spark plugs ) and it will make use of a fairly significantly sized capacitor.

If you power up the ECU and the capacitor charges up and then you short the wire the capacitor will instantly discharge power back towards the short.

It's possible that this quick jump of current done several times could damage the circuit traces or connector on the ECU power board.

Honestly...... I wish I could give you a simple answer..... but it could be a number of different issues..... I just think the ECU may be a good place to start.

Given you have a 1.4L I'm guessing your from the UK..... would that be correct??

Do you know of anyone else that could loan you an ECU to check it out??

With the wiring correctly repaired there should be no risk of damaging a new ECU (again.... as long as it was rewired correctly)

Wappy · Post by **Wappy** » Wed Aug 29, 2007 9:13 am

Thanks for all your replys

Well last night i went and checked all the wires and they all seem fine recharged my batt and then this morning tested the car and its still the same problem.

Just one thing tho PrecisionBoost you mentioned

"Basicly.... the primary damage would be from the cause of the short back to the fuse panel...."

There was a BIG spark from there and only 1 fuse was blow is there a possibility it could have damaged something there??? just assumed its wires and fuses only not much to damage....

but also yes im in the UK but unfortunately this car is not very common, as just a quick swap of the ecu would tell me if the problem is there, but again finding someone who could help is proving hard, hence why i was wondering re the OBD tester off ebay and would that be able to help in finding the problem..

Eg unable to read, then problem with ECU, it reads and gives a error code then fix the error code problem, but the only thing is im not sure if it will be that simple.

oh and thanks gusy for all you help to press

Turtle_Wax · Post by **Turtle_Wax** » Wed Aug 29, 2007 2:47 pm

I'm also UK and have a 1998 1.4 lanos (it's a 1.3 in other countries) Mine has the older 12pin ALDL diagnostic connector located under the glove box. I check for any error codes using the paperclip method to jumper pins A+B and count the CEL flashes. If yours is same, if you want I can try take a pic of my ALDL to show which pins to jump.

If it's an ECU prob this place does ecu testing from £35 and repairs from £65
http://www.peacockandpurvey.co.uk

Wappy · Post by **Wappy** » Wed Aug 29, 2007 4:34 pm

Turtle wax thanks for the reply

I took a picture of mine if that helps alittle

and this is the ECU

as you can see the repaired cables just below

and one other questions where do i count the CEL flashes? eg where is the cel or am i overlooking a simple acronym lol

Turtle_Wax · Post by **Turtle_Wax** » Wed Aug 29, 2007 6:36 pm

Yes that's the 12pin ALDL socket same as mine. The CEL is the orange check engine light (picture of an engine) that lights up with the ignition and should go out once started. Connect a paperclip to A+B pins on the ALDL and turn on ignition while observing the CEL light. The radiator cooling fan will also come on as you check for error codes so don't worry about the noise.

Short pins B&A

Turn ignition on (do not start)

Read check engine light flashes for code.

You will first get a code 12 to show it's in diagnostic mode

One flash, pause, Two flashes = Code 12

Three flashes, pause, one flash = Code 31

Here's a good site I found which explains it better
http://www.gnttype.org/maint/malf.html

And to make sure here is your pic with the pins to short indicated
Let us know if you have any stored codes.

Wappy · Post by **Wappy** » Wed Aug 29, 2007 7:15 pm

Thanks Turtle_Wax thats a great help

anyway the results are in and i get

CODE 12 ERROR CODE DIAGNOSTIC SYSTEM FUNCTIONING CORRECTLY

it just flashes once then twice constantly (Loop)

Does this mean the ECU if fine as i would have got a error code 55??

AGGH

Again thanks for Everyones help to press

Turtle_Wax · Post by **Turtle_Wax** » Wed Aug 29, 2007 8:09 pm

As the car starts but immediately dies, if it was an immobiliser fault then according to the service manual it should leave an error code 53. However it says that the immobiliser fault code will clear itself when the ignition is switched off. So just to eliminate the immobiliser I would start the car and let the engine die but don't switch of the ignition and check again for any error codes. Other than that I'm afraid I'm not much use in trying to pinpoint wiring probs.

If you want a copy of the Lanos service manual which may show wiring diagrams I got a pdf version from this link (about 55mb).
http://rapidshare.com/files/32519625/DLSARM.rar.html

Wappy · Post by **Wappy** » Wed Aug 29, 2007 8:34 pm

Thanks for that i'll try that tomorrow and let you know how it goes

i'll give the lanos service manual a look over, tbh disappointed there isn't even a daewoo haynes manual

BTW the file says it is password locked, don't suppose you know what it is, if you don't no worries i'll brute force rip it this weekend when my pc is free might just save a few hours

Turtle_Wax · Post by **Turtle_Wax** » Wed Aug 29, 2007 9:11 pm

Oops forgot about the password, it's: hvala
Good luck and hope you get it sorted.

Post by **PrecisionBoost** » Thu Aug 30, 2007 3:24 am

Generally speaking it is possible that damage could occur within the connection to the fuse panel.... but it's not very likely.

If it was me... I would have checked continuity between the wires and their respective places in the fuse panel as well as from the wire to the ECU connector before I did anything else.

That way you can rule out damage to the wiring between the fuse panel and ECU.... which takes one possible issue out of the equation.

The way you describe things I have to think that Turtle Wax might be onto something with the immobiliser..... hopefully you figure it out with the code retrieval.

Chris