Won't Start

69Boss302 · Post by **69Boss302** » Sat Mar 18, 2006 8:36 pm

OK, I'm a bit embarassed. I have worked on a lot of older cars and this one I don't understand. Have a 2001 Laganza that just started sputering and died at the post office. Couldn't get it started again. Would turn over but wouldn't start. Thought maybe a clogged fuel filter or a vapor lock since I live way down south where it's always hot. Was close to 90 that day. Just towed it home and started working on it. Tried starting once got it home and it wouldn't even turn over. OK hooked up the jumper cables and still wouldn't turn over. Lights would dim, voltage on the battery would drop to about 9 volts, my truck even gave a little groan. Still wouldn't crank. I thought Oh great starter burned up. Now after figuring out all the little hiden things to get the starter out. (WOW do you need small hands to work on these things). I just hooked up the battery to the starter to check it out and away it spun. OK now I really groan and figure so the starter is good. I just went into deep depresion and said, OK next take a peek at the spark plugs, could of locked something up and usually a quick check of the plugs can tell you something. Now is where I get real confused. Went to pull the spark plugs and of course they are under the cover in the middle of the heads, that I knew but when I pulled the plug wires the entire plug hole is full of oil. Now stupid question that shows my age perhapes. Is it supposed to be that way? I'm not used to oil filled plug holes.

Thanks for any input you could give me.

Audacity Racing · Post by **Audacity Racing** » Sat Mar 18, 2006 8:41 pm

uh... oil in the plug holes is a bad thing... it's probably a cam cover gasket that is leaking into them. now... as to why it would prevent you from cranking, i can think of two things and both aren't good.

with the plugs OUT... bump teh starter and see if it blows oil out of the holes. if the motor turns over... you may just have oil in the cylinders (leaking around the sparkplugs).

if it's not that, it also seems so share some symptoms with a broken timing belt

69Boss302 · Post by **69Boss302** » Sat Mar 18, 2006 8:44 pm

Thank's those were just the line of things I was thinking and I just didn't want to admit it, Much less go there and have to start tearing things down to parade rest.

MMamdouh · Post by **MMamdouh** » Sat Mar 18, 2006 10:45 pm

the oil is the last thing you need to worry about at this point... it is a standard issue faulty cam cover gasket.

as Auda suggested, i am afraid this might be a brocken timing belt, try to take the plastic cover of the cam gears and inspect the belt.

MMamdouh

69Boss302 · Post by **69Boss302** » Sat Mar 18, 2006 10:58 pm

Thank's MMamdouh, the timing cover was my next step. Luckily this car is the third car so my wife and I are not stranded. Also means I work on it when I get the chance and that means

well you get the point. Going to put the starter back on first and then pull the cam cover and then the timing belt cover. Just hope my hands don't get to beat up. Like I said before I like to work on older cars where they used to give you enough room to pull up a chair inside the engine compartment and have at it. Not to many hoses and junk in your way either.

ubuyau · Post by **ubuyau** » Sat Mar 18, 2006 11:13 pm

69Boss302 wrote:Thank's MMamdouh, the timing cover was my next step. Luckily this car is the third car so my wife and I are not stranded. Also means I work on it when I get the chance and that means well you get the point. Going to put the starter back on first and then pull the cam cover and then the timing belt cover. Just hope my hands don't get to beat up. Like I said before I like to work on older cars where they used to give you enough room to pull up a chair inside the engine compartment and have at it. Not to many hoses and junk in your way either.

Yeah, space owns you on little cars. You've got to get real creative to access some stuff.
You'll learn to love it one day!

--Tim

tango · Post by **tango** » Sun Mar 19, 2006 12:46 am

I'd like to think that if the engine isn't turning over like you described I'd be thinking timing belt for starters too. Correction...timing belt, valves, camshaft (?) pistons (?)...

Slammed · Post by **Slammed** » Sun Mar 19, 2006 4:41 am

a real quick easy test to see if the timing belt broke is to have someone turn it over while you look into the oil spout it you see the lifters moving up and down you should be ok because in my opinion it sounds like the coil is shot

if it is the coil wait till the car is cool (like the next morning) and see if it starts up if it does let it idle for awhile and when the coil heats up if its bad it will stall out

Audacity Racing · Post by **Audacity Racing** » Sun Mar 19, 2006 5:23 am

the reason i suggested oil may be in the combustion chamber is that if enough oil were to cascade into a cylinder, it would not compress and thus the car would NOT turn over

MMamdouh · Post by **MMamdouh** » Sun Mar 19, 2006 9:04 am

well... theoritically that is correct but on the practical side of things i don't think the accumilated oil in the spark plug hole is that suffecent to cause a hydro lock in a 550cc combustion chamber.

MMamdouh

69Boss302 · Post by **69Boss302** » Sun Mar 26, 2006 6:21 pm

OK I got the starter back on, and the timing belt cover pulled. Belt is intact but it looks loose just on the bottom. One of what looks to be just a timing belt pulley is, well doesn't look good

There was a piece that looks like a ball bearing cage (I'm an electric motor head), but I know there are know ball bearings in there, anyway, it was kind of hanging out of the roller. I will take some pictures later if I can and post them if I can figure out how to do that.

Well the roller is not sitting centered on the nut and it doesn't spin, where the one on the other side will spin, because the belt is loose to it. Now, is this a matter of simply replacing the roller and probably the belt since I'm in there, 75,000 miles on the car. Or since the engine seems locked up, did I jumb a tooth on the belt somewhere and really mess something up.

Well just wanted to update you and see if there were any other idea's. I still need to pull the cam cover and replace the gasket. I'm just wondering if there is any way to make sure everything is lined back up correctly without tearing the engine apart.

I was trying to post a drawing put I guess I'm to computer illiterate. If you have the service manual, the pulley is piece #9, it's the left one and it's part 1333 timing cover (2.0DOHC)

MMamdouh · Post by **MMamdouh** » Mon Mar 27, 2006 12:30 am

69Boss302 wrote: I will take some pictures later if I can and post them if I can figure out how to do that.

check the how to section for detailed steps on doing that

MMamdouh

kurnia_2 · Post by **kurnia_2** » Mon Mar 27, 2006 7:41 am

69Boss302 wrote:OK I got the starter back on, and the timing belt cover pulled. Belt is intact but it looks loose just on the bottom. One of what looks to be just a timing belt pulley is, well doesn't look good There was a piece that looks like a ball bearing cage (I'm an electric motor head), but I know there are know ball bearings in there, anyway, it was kind of hanging out of the roller. I will take some pictures later if I can and post them if I can figure out how to do that.

Well the roller is not sitting centered on the nut and it doesn't spin, where the one on the other side will spin, because the belt is loose to it. Now, is this a matter of simply replacing the roller and probably the belt since I'm in there, 75,000 miles on the car. Or since the engine seems locked up, did I jumb a tooth on the belt somewhere and really mess something up.

Well just wanted to update you and see if there were any other idea's. I still need to pull the cam cover and replace the gasket. I'm just wondering if there is any way to make sure everything is lined back up correctly without tearing the engine apart.

I was trying to post a drawing put I guess I'm to computer illiterate. If you have the service manual, the pulley is piece #9, it's the left one and it's part 1333 timing cover (2.0DOHC)

Did the engine turn over after you reinstalled the starter motor?
How's the oil level?

69Boss302 · Post by **69Boss302** » Mon Mar 27, 2006 11:07 am

Nope, still did the same, solinoid picked up but no crank and Battery Voltage Droped. Oil level is OK.

(Edited) Is there a spell checker for this forum?

kurnia_2 · Post by **kurnia_2** » Mon Mar 27, 2006 8:05 pm

69Boss302 wrote:Nope, still did the same, solinoid picked up but no crank and Battery Voltage Droped. Oil level is OK.

(Edited) Is there a spell checker for this forum?

Starter motor can be tested good with no load but failed when tested with load (i.e. on an engine)
Make sure the starters terminals are intact.
I've experienced a bad battery may cause an engine not to turn over.

Some suggestions:

Try removing the terminals from the battery and then boost it.
Also try to turn the crank pulley by hand with ratchet, extension, and socket to make sure engine is not seized up. But I doubt that because you said oil level was OK. If possible, while turning the crank pulley, also open the oil cap and see if the cam is turning, as suggested by slammed.

The original daewootech forum

Won't Start

Won't Start

Timing belt pulley

Re: Timing belt pulley

Re: Timing belt pulley